Appalbarry writes:
"It's my birthday, and that means it's time to renew my Driver's Licence for another five years.
New this year in British Columbia is a new edict that your Drivers' Licence will now be part of the BC Services Card which will also be used as your Medical Services Plan (MSP) card (that's universal healthcare), and presumably for most other government services in the future.
I'm not overly paranoid, but using the same card for accessing my driving record and my medical records feels like very, very bad idea. Between Snowden, Anonymous, and a more or less daily list of hacked systems and sites, it seems to me that I'll be much better protected if my health records stay in their own little box, away from anything else.
In simple terms, if Buddy at the car rental agency or at a bar can read the magnetic stripe to get my DL number, I'm going to assume that he can also get at my MSP number.
Which is why I'm currently engaged in a loooong e-mail exchange with a faceless bureaucrat*, whose only line of defense is:
Personal information collected when applying for a BC Services Card will only be used to confirm your identity and eligibility when you choose to enrol in a service. Your personal information will only be disclosed to services you have accessed with your card. Unless it is authorized by law, you records will not be shared across agencies providing services.
Your medical and driver's licence records are not shared between agencies. A health care provider will not able to access your driving record and a police officer will not be able to access your health records.
Interestingly, they have yet to specifically say that I can't insist that my Medical Services ID not be included on my Drivers' Licence, so I'm thinking it's possible, but they don't want to say so.
* literally they don't identify themselves, and are known only as 'Identity Services Desk.'"
(Score: 5, Insightful) by edIII on Tuesday March 04 2014, @03:09AM
That's a trend to remove accountability in customer 'service'. Do you remember who you talked with? Uhhh no, they refused and said it was against policy. Ohh, well we will just look into that and get back to you....
(Score: 3, Insightful) by gottabeme on Tuesday March 04 2014, @03:41AM
Since we're sort of starting over, I wonder if we should reconsider the "from the ... dept" lines. Maybe it's just me, but it seems like a long time ago, they made a little more sense. Now they're just a random thought with "from the ... dept" tagged on.
What if they made sense instead? Like, this story could say, "from the Identity Services dept", which would be very appropriate. Or it could be something that tries to be funny, like... (these are going to be bad)
I dent a tea service is dept
Identity Theft Assistance dept (could be read as assisting the theft of identity)
Identity Thief Assistance dept (less obtuse)
PII Sharing dept (Personally Identifying Information...but read it out loud, haha...)
I don't know, these aren't clever at all, I just always thought that the "from the ... dept" lines could be done in a way so they make more sense.
(Score: 2) by nitehawk214 on Tuesday March 04 2014, @12:28PM
I think the departments are auto-generated. (or I assume the gaggle of geese that generated this page are)
However I thought the original idea behind the departments came from MAD Magazine, where they were some sort of backhanded pun. The best kind of pun...
"Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
(Score: 2, Insightful) by emallson on Tuesday March 04 2014, @01:15PM
Dunno, but the dept names are usually good for a chuckle (and some have been pretty hilarious).
(Score: 4, Insightful) by hemocyanin on Tuesday March 04 2014, @03:59AM
You know, if WA, OR, and BC all seceded from their respective Eastern overlords (remember, Mordor is always to the east) -- we could join up and form the best country on earth: Cascadia. In this pipe dream, Cascadia would always be cognizant of your right to privacy and seek to protect it, rather than make you exploitable.
(Score: 3, Funny) by edIII on Tuesday March 04 2014, @04:22AM
Yes... Yes... and in this mythical land where government respects you do I get a state issued unicorn along with my steak and BJ machine?
(Score: 3, Funny) by hemocyanin on Tuesday March 04 2014, @04:43AM
Almost. Unicorns will still be mythical and eating meat will be frowned upon. But the BJ machines will be free.
(Score: 2) by davester666 on Tuesday March 04 2014, @05:10AM
Course, the BJ machines are all male.
(Score: 2) by edIII on Tuesday March 04 2014, @03:30PM
Isn't that the same principle that makes those 77 virgins the Mujahideen get male too? :)
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 04 2014, @11:32AM
>> state issued unicorn along with my steak and BJ machine
It's three, three, three things in one.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by jimshatt on Tuesday March 04 2014, @04:05AM
It'd probably be possible to conceive of a system that grants car rental companies access to only DL data, while medical services only have access to you medical ID. Something with encrypting the different sets of data differently and issuing different decryption keys to the appropriate services, or something.
Aside from this, most companies will supply you with all the data you want if you just know someone's name and birthdate (sometimes current address).
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Maow on Tuesday March 04 2014, @04:17AM
I was shown one of these one month ago today, and the nice lady told me it was optional when she got hers. I think she phrased it as an extra cost for the dual card.
I thought it a bad idea, and am due for a new BC drivers' licence this year myself, so will decline if possible.
I haven't seen my MSP card in a decade or more. Got the number from a doctor's office on a visit, wrote it on a post-it note, and use that. I just presented a current MSP statement to the doc's receptionist, she looked up the number.
Post back your results if you attempt to decline the merged cards.
(Score: 4, Informative) by edIII on Tuesday March 04 2014, @04:24AM
They did something similar in some US states by requiring that the social be embedded in the driver's license, which it is on mine.
There was a beautiful time in this country where you were not required to have a social to get a driver's license or identification card.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by tibman on Tuesday March 04 2014, @10:26AM
That is so strange. SSN is for national level identification. DLN is used for state level. How are you supposed to protect your social security number if you have to carry it everywhere?
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(Score: 3, Informative) by Spook brat on Tuesday March 04 2014, @12:39PM
This is already how it is for U.S. service members (i.e. soldiers, sailors, etc) - the ID number on the U.S. Armed Forces ID card is the social security number. Since that's effectively your driver's license and default photo ID on base you are essentially giving out your SSN whenever you get asked for photo ID. I never did figure out how that fit in with the provisions of the Privacy Act of 1974 [dev.soylentnews.org] (link is to a previous comment on a similar topic).
I think that the Privacy Act was a great piece of legislation, but it didn't have enough teeth - from my reading it only restricted the actions of government agencies wrt your SSN. It would have been much more useful if it also applied to civilians as well.
(Score: 1) by tibman on Tuesday March 04 2014, @01:46PM
I forgot about the SSN on the CAC. You're right, that doesn't make sense. Especially when they can verify your identity even better via the chip & pin.
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(Score: 5, Insightful) by edIII on Tuesday March 04 2014, @12:53PM
SSN was never supposed to be used for identification in the first place. You can call it feature-creep, but it's really corruption-creep, or totalitarianism-creep.
Especially, with the absolute rampant stupidity of also using it as a password (Yes, that's me. Sure. Trust me.), the gateway to receiving credit reports (ding your credit), falsifying loan/credit/service documents (Sprint *WILL* sue you in court even if you are the victim), etc.
The SSN simply accesses way too much data, allows way to much authority to the person possessing one, and is just plain dangerous.
Of course it all started with the idea that it would be used for Social Security, not taxation purposes, and then the general full-retardity that you see now.
(Score: 1) by dw861 on Tuesday March 04 2014, @05:11PM
Conflicting info on this point, at least online.
http://www.newsroom.gov.bc.ca/2013/02/new-bc-servi ces-card-replaces-carecard.html [gov.bc.ca]
"Myth: It is mandatory to combine my driver's licence and health card.
Fact: A combined card is optional and entirely your choice. You may combine your driver's licence and BC Services Card for convenience or keep them independent."
vs the much more recent
http://www.health.gov.bc.ca/msp/pdf/bc-services-ca rd-qa-for-group-plan.pdf [gov.bc.ca]
"4. Are British Colubmian's required to get a BC Services Card?
Starting February 15, 2013, most eligible adult B.C. residents between 19 and 74 years of age will be required to renew enrolment in MSP over the next five years. Eligible individuals who successfully enrol or renew enrolment in MSP can then be issued a BC Services Card.
-Adults who are required to renew enrolment in MSP but fail to do so by 2018 may have their coverage lapse. "
I tend to believe this version, which states that it is mandatory:a n/bc-services-card/ [hr.ubc.ca]
http://www.hr.ubc.ca/benefits/medical-services-pl
(Score: 2) by Appalbarry on Tuesday March 04 2014, @11:32PM
Finally nailed it today. Well, as it turns out, you can choose to not have your Medical Services info added to your Drivers licence - you can choose to have two separate cards.
And it only took a month and about twenty e-mails to find this out!
(Score: 1) by dw861 on Wednesday March 05 2014, @09:04PM
Thank you for sharing this info--I appreciate it and will do as you suggest, myself.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by cafebabe on Tuesday March 04 2014, @04:43AM
I believe that the good people south of the border were told the same thing: "Your number will only be used for official things and there will be laws and safeguards in place to prevent abuse." Now, if they're desperate, they have to provide that official number for a credit check or to apply for work [dev.soylentnews.org]
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Luke on Tuesday March 04 2014, @05:39AM
"..records are not shared between agencies.." did anyone see the silent 'YET'?
I don't know much about Canada but in my view *any* sharing of data without the express permission of the data subject (ie. the person whom the data is about) is dangerous and should be avoided at all costs.
Such actions are arrogant and disrespectful, they ablate a fundamental human right to privacy and ownership of themselves and lead to state where such information is considered so cheap that any safeguards are eventually dropped and it becomes a free-for-all.
The trouble is that people are so much like sheep - if the Govt says it's good then it's got to be so and we'll all follow the leader... ah well I suppose it'll make the NSA's job easier >:-(
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Bob the Super Hamste on Tuesday March 04 2014, @09:48AM
To me it would appear that the problem line is this:
Which should probably be read as:
Since as you have correctly pointed out they person at the car rental place will swipe your drivers license to get it entered into their system. Also since Canada seems to like to follow my countrie's stupid in a lot of cases I will assume that various retailers swipe your license to verify you are of legal age to purchase things like alcohol and tabacco, or any other age restricted item, so now add in every teenaged convience store clerk can have access to it. Also assuming that Canada is like Minnesota in this reguards they swipe your drivers license when getting a fishing or hunting license, not because they have to but because it reads in and populates a lot of the fields automatically and makes their job easier.
If you are really paranoid about the data on the mag stripe just run a nice strong rare earth magnet across it a couple of times to wipe all of the data. Another option might be to get one of the magstripe reader/writers [amazon.com] and read in all of the data off of the card remove anything you don't want to have on there, and write a cleansed set of data back.
Learn to take care of your vehicle [blogspot.com]
(Score: 2, Informative) by Kromagv0 on Tuesday March 04 2014, @10:03AM
Without knowing the law you many not be legally allowed to change stuff on the card but would appear that BC indicates that it is "your" card (mentioned in the pages from the like the submitter provided) so there might be some ownership rights there but I don't know Canadian or BC law. Also it would seem that the parent is correct that in at least BC you have to show your ID for confirmniation of age, address, or when using cheques and credit cards [welcomebc.ca]. So it sounds like any idiot with a magstipe reader and questionable morals will have access to your data.
T-Shirts and bumper stickers [zazzle.com] to offend someone
(Score: 2, Interesting) by dpp on Tuesday March 04 2014, @03:35PM
I'm a US ex-pat, from CA, living in BC these past 6yrs. I've never ONCE had my (BC) driver's license "swiped".
I renewed my DL a while back and did not receive a dual purpose card.
Full disclosure - my spouse works for the gov dept associated with this integration effort, so I'll find out if there's more public information available to share on how info on the dual cards is protected. Will post back after I research it.
Again, I've never once had my DL swiped/read for any purpose. "Looked at" to confirm birthday/age (drinks), sure...but never scanned. YMMV
(Score: 1) by Bob the Super Hamste on Wednesday March 05 2014, @11:21AM
Well it sounds like people are more rational there than they are here in my state. Most places don't bother to look at my drivers licence to see if it matches me but instead just swipe it through the reader to validate my age.
Learn to take care of your vehicle [blogspot.com]
(Score: 5, Interesting) by VLM on Tuesday March 04 2014, @10:13AM
Nobody's come up with the actual reason for this yet? It has to do with stacking charges, a classic American legal system technique. A counterfeit insurance card is about as illegal as a counterfeit company ID, or a counterfeit legacy brick and mortar loyalty card, although I am not a lawyer blah blah blah. However, now its going to impossible to have a fake med card without it also being a fake ID, and cops just love F-ing with people who have fake IDs.
The charge stacking ties in with plea bargaining in the USA, its not so much that people will get convicted of fake drivers license, its more like the prosecutor will throw out that charge rather than currently throwing out the medical ID fraud charge or whatever. So you'll probably see conviction rates via plea bargains exploding upward for related offenses, not so much for fake drivers licenses.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by metamonkey on Tuesday March 04 2014, @02:32PM
Also, since the records are electronic and you're trying to fool them, they'll throw in some kind of Computer Fraud Haxzoring charge for another 10 years.
Left a beta website for an alpha website.
(Score: 5, Informative) by Appalbarry on Tuesday March 04 2014, @11:25AM
Wowza - the BC Civil Liberties Assn did a massive report on these cards and came down squarely opposed. This is really required reading.
A National ID Card by Stealth? The BC Services Card: Privacy, Risks and Alternatives [bccla.org]
(Score: 3, Informative) by Appalbarry on Tuesday March 04 2014, @11:30PM
Well, as it turns out, you can choose to not have your Medical Services info added to your Drivers licence - you can choose to have two separate cards.
And it only took a month and about twenty e-mails to find this out!